Read Latest Entries..: (Post #19) by Opethian on Apr 30 2006, 09:45 PM. (Line Breaks Removed)
I have read an article regarding LiNUX Gurus being the downfall of the OS itself. There are just too many newbies out there and a large portion of those newbs get shotdown apparantly for almost nothing at all.I think it's an elitist attitude, as being a person knowing a lot about LiNUX (pardon my spelling, LoL), they took the time to learn it, and probably have something in their life making t... read more.
Hmm, off the posts and topic is just started in the operating system section. Well i was just going tru some of my old posts, and while browsing i realised that some days ago, there was a tutorial posted, well i didnt know then because i had clicked on the recent posted links and got there. I saw that post again. It was a tutorial on Tweaking Nvidia Gfx.
Well it was my mistake i didnt see that it was in the linux section and i went accouring to the tutorial, till i came again and posted a message that this wasent working, yeah "i am retarded" i know, i still didnt motice the tutorial was for linux. Anyhow, after the post another post was made below me.
QUOTE(WaCo @ Aug 11 2005, 12:04 PM)
You are n00b....big n00b. No offense.
Every Linux is based on command prompt ! You can't use Linux without using command prompt ( command prompt <=> bash <==> shell <=> Bourne again shell ). 90% things which you perform, you do right in the command prompt. Where the command prompt is? Press ctrl+alt+F2 and you'll see. Where to learn how to use it? read abs.
Notice from Klass:
I am a Supreme Elite Linux Guru. I like to make new linux users feel like they are dirt under my feet. Next time I make someone feel like that Klass will ban me.
When i went there today i noticed the note made by klass, but just out of curiosity, not any forum in particular, how can you expect someone to know everything that exists ? When ur asked a dum question ( hoping it was a windows question and not seeing it was for linux ) would you rather tell the person the right answer or get sercastic ?
Just a thought. No hard feelings from my side, but this message kinda got me into a fire start for learning linux, and hell m doing pretty much i can to get standing, atleast so that the next time sumone else does what i did in a forum not noticing the topic, i would rather guide him to the right source or just tell him what the topic is really for.
I have seen people around in real life who do the same, and m pretty much shure all of you have seen too. People who know alot in a certain topic may or may not willingly help u at times, but atleast a certain amount of respect for feelings should be kept. Maybe at times u really do wish to help, and get frustrated with the questions ur asked with, but c'mon, the questions u know pretty well, the other person dosent have a clue.
So just requesting you guys or for that matter any one who comes to this forum, please do not make a newbie feel like a newbie, there are ways to tell, much better ways to do that, just dont try thinking u r god in what u know atleast spare astahost from the snobishness that other forums brag about.
Aw the newbe feeling. I know it so well I ask for help and what I get is so far over my head I need a helcopter just to see it. It helps if you place it in plan english tha a two year old could follow. When I answer a post I try to place my help in detail and try to paint a picture so they could follow. At the moment I seeking help in the pear/cgi area and it apears I'm on my own to figure out what I'm doing wronge. But oh well ignore the nubie I know it all so well.
Actually Dhanesh, this sort of thing is quite rare on Asta. That's one of the main things that really appeals to me on this forum. Other forums actually fry newbies for asking questions which are below (according to the more 'senior' members) the 'intellectual level' of the forum. One example is the number of topics about 'which Linux is the best' or to that effect. All of these topics have an active and constructive participation by many of the members (esp qwijibow... he's been a wealth of knowledge on most of them ).
I hope there won't be anymore flames like this one. If you have to criticize, please do so constructively and not rudely.
I hope there won't be anymore flames like this one. If you have to criticize, please do so constructively and not rudely.
I do agree that this forum is far better than the ones that tell you to ask questions "worth" their time. And i wasent being rude , sorry if my way of explaining seemed that say, but i didnt mean to even criticize. Its just that I wanted to be frank about how any newbie with NO knowledge of the subject would have felt, the knowledge of everything you know shouldent be at a high heap when u talk with a newbie who dosent know anything about the subject.
Alright f'get about the forums, how many of us do this is real life ? i accept i do it too, i aint the perfect cool dude, but i do realise the effect on the other person.
And i dunt hope, I know that this wouldent happen here again, my case mite be 0.1 out of 100, but i do love to hang out here. Its a fun place and want it to stay this way
Cheers .. n Sorry again abhiram, i didnt mean to be rude m8.
I wasn't talking about you Dhanesh... I meant WaCo. He's the one flaming you right?
QUOTE
I hope there won't be anymore flames like this one. If you have to criticize, please do so constructively and not rudely.
'This one' doesn't mean this post, it refers to the post you quoted in your first post. I meant that it wasn't right of him to have said it like that to you no matter how superior he is to you in Linux.
One time I was sexin up this chick and she called me a n00b and kicked me out of her bed... ... ...
But nah seriously most people seem to fry "n00bs" to feel suprerior I guess. So many people online are seriously on a "OMG I R T3H 1337!" psycho trip and they just try to make themselves seem as much above anyone and everyone else as possible. Myself, I know I've done it sometimes if someone does something STUPID...like common sense should have stopped it... but otherwise I try my best to help out the 'n00bs'. I know I have been one, and will be in places I'm new too many times more and it's nice to help out and be helped in return.
But alas, ever since the first man stepped onto the inatrwebs, he was ready to bash the one that followed for being a n00b. Too bad but its assumedly here to stay :S
One time I was sexin up this chick and she called me a n00b and kicked me out of her bed...
You made me laugh out loud, Jeigh.
Back to the topic at hand, I'm not sure that these n00b-haters are really malevolent. Perhaps they're just initiating the new blood into the fold with good-natured ribbing. It's this principle that you must pay your dues before being accepted as an equal. Yes, it does seem harsh, but the n00b begins to feel a sense of pride as he/she advances in the group. I imagine this creates a greater sense of community.
I'm not saying this system of denigration is better, just that it has its own advantages. Personally, I'd rather not be called an idiot every time I ask a question.
"Grasshopper you must start at the bottom and climb the ladder..."
As with anything in life we all have to admit, to ourselves first, that we know nothing. The problem with this is that some people take the wrong approch and take out their frustrations on others when they get the chance. By this I mean that when they feel in adiquit in one area they seek out someone to demorilise in an area that they know about to bolster their own ego.
I've seen this happen more in the IT feild then almost anywhere else. The reaone I feel this happens more here, ie the IT feild, then anywhere else is that even the most simple of processes are hidden behind complex and obscure terminology. While if your "in the know" you can speak "IT geek", as my mom used to say, fluently most people can't.
In our repectful feilds the higher you get, the harder it is at times to remember that not everyone will understand what you say. Whether we realize it or not we all do it, but those that seem to go out of their way, such as the post qouted at the begining, need to be brought to task IMO.
Those that pray on the "NoobS" to raise their own self estime make the rest of us look bad when we do it unintentionaly.
Well sorry for my long drawn out rant...I'll let someone else have their turn now...
I have read an article regarding LiNUX Gurus being the downfall of the OS itself. There are just too many newbies out there and a large portion of those newbs get shotdown apparantly for almost nothing at all.
I think it's an elitist attitude, as being a person knowing a lot about LiNUX (pardon my spelling, LoL), they took the time to learn it, and probably have something in their life making them grumpy, like say their GF suddenly decided to go Vista... or sumthin...
Anyways, I think "no pain, no gain" applies here. You want to learn the best OS out there? You have to earn the respect then. Everyone starts out as a noob, in one form or another. I know I was, and somewhat still is, to a certain extent.
I don't think any perceived mistreatment is intended. I think the perception comes from the fact that joining any community involves a learning process. Learning how to communicate with these particular people and those people also learning how to communicate with you without either trampling on the other's sensitivities, or more often learning endure and ignore such tramplings.
This experience is not something that only the lesser informed joinees go through, sometimes it is even worse when you are rather knowlegeable. Much knowlege often accompanies strong opinions and this will most likely get you torpedoed until you and the other knowlegeable members of the community teach each other to respect one another for the differing sets of knowlege and expertise that you and they have.
Generally around here it is because of kids wanting to be special and like they know it all. Personally, I stop reading any response that is not typed in proper english with proper spelling. Now I will overlook grammer and spelling errors as I mistype more than I care to admit. But as soon as anyone starts using numbers instead of letters trying to be "cool" I ignore them.
Another factor is that people that bash newer users have little else to be excited about in their life. I wonder how many of these bashers really have a life outside of their computer screen? I work around computers all day long and the last thing I want to do when I get home is play on them. Hell, I barely check my personal email anymore. When I get home, I want to watch TV, go play hockey, or do something else.
Back when I was in college and had more desire to play games online, I played Rainbow 6 online, I used to host a lot of games. As soon as some punk kid would enter and boast about how drunk he was or how "elite" he was using numbers and letters I'd boot him. Other more casual players that were there to have fun loved it and I got a pretty large following of people that enjoyed the fact I controlled my game room trying to have fun.
====== I was just in a popular forum for Blender 3D users (won't name it here). I was reading a thread where the someone was complaining that all the users work there was "crap noobie work" and that it really hurt Blender as a professional 3D program. It really ticked the crap out of me because Blender is a great learning tool and there are a few users that can do some amazing work, but most of the people that use Blender 3D do so because it is free where most other 3D animation programs cost hundreds and even thousands of dollars. Anyone interested in getting into the 3D field, I recommend take a look at Blender and try to learn the basics of how Keyframing, rendering, IK engines, and particles work. While those features may have different keystrokes in say Lightwave, the basic principles on HOW they work remain the same. I started with 3D Studio Max in college, then moved on to Lightwave later and came to blender for personal use.
Now there are some people that seem to have a gift with these programs and can do some wonderful things. Most others it takes a longer period to learn, especially with blender because the program has extremely poor documentation when compared to commerical applications. Most of the Tutorials are written from the perspective that you already know blender and have been using it since version 1.8.
Anyway, the user was complaining until someone when and dug up some his early work from two or three years ago that was pure crap. People start getting egos and want to be known as the king of the mountain. True in any line of work. Most often, the ones that are sucessful are the ones that can make complex things simple. That is basically what I do now. I the technology of our business simple for the office people to understand. "We have no pressing need for the features of Lightwave 9. Let's wait until version 9.1 comes out with any bug fixes before upgrading." "These quad-core Powermacs offer the same power as 5 Xserves on the render farm for one third the price" etc.. One a more personal level, we usually have to trasition office people over to Mac OSX from Windows when they first come here. Some of them can be annoying, but they appreciate it when you will spend time and help them understand why.
If anyone remembers the "Nick the computer guy" scetch from SNL a couple years ago...well that is how so many IT act that when true professonals come along, it makes us look like heros...
So just requesting you guys or for that matter any one who comes to this forum, please do not make a newbie feel like a newbie, there are ways to tell, much better ways to do that, just dont try thinking u r god in what u know atleast spare astahost from the snobishness that other forums brag about.
Cheers
Everyone either was, or is, a newbie, especially when anything related to computers is involved.
I could tell all sorts of fun stories about hard drives I've crashed, operating systems I've trashed, and mice that mysteriously dropped dead in my hand. But most of you probably did the same things when you were just starting.
I'm not a computer genius, but I like being able to help people who don't understand something that I can do. I didn't really have anybody to teach me, so I had to either figure things out for myself or try to find the answers in books (which doesn't always work very well, as many of you probably know). I think that, if I'd had access to this type of forum when I started out with computers however many years ago, I would know more today ... and wouldn't have destroyed so many computer systems with my big, big, costly mistakes *grins*
So ... I'm in total agreement about being nice to newbies.
Using leetspeak is only funny to make fun of n00bies. For example:
Me and a friend of mine are pwning a team deathmatch game of Call of Duty, and the rest of game consists of people who can't even aim properly or are just plain bad at the game.
Then we both start using chat-binds like "I @m teh Pwn@ge" just to piss other people of and get a few laughs while talking a bit through teamspeak.
My point is that leet-speak is better used for chatting with friends to indicate something funny.
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atleast spare astahost from the snobishness that other forums brag about.
). 
